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	<title>Comments on: The unbundled album</title>
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	<description>The net&#039;s first, and only, artists-to-fans-to-artists blog!</description>
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		<title>By: bill</title>
		<link>http://a2f2a.com/2010/01/27/the-unbundled-album/comment-page-1/#comment-1926</link>
		<dc:creator>bill</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 28 Jan 2010 08:11:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://a2f2a.com/?p=1290#comment-1926</guid>
		<description>@ Robert #2
I see control as the more motivating factor (over choice) as a primary resistance to such schemes. In a time when folks feel (with justifyable reason) that they have so little control over their own lives, I doubt seriously if control over their music collection (music is a human need after all) will be given up nilly willy. I&#039;d love to see a figure on how many music fans stream from archive.org as opposed to how many download. (I download from it - I happen to be a big fan of live performance.) There is some security in knowing that if the rules change (and they always change)that you will still have access to music that you cherish. No matter if the IP owner decides to withdraw it. No matter how poor you might become. No matter what restrictions and punishments your government might enact. And if you have a mind to, share it with as many friends as you want to. Even after an IP owner has decided that it will no longer be available. I think one of the most powerful statements that p2p has made is this: &quot;You&#039;ve stolen so much conrol from my life, but you&#039;re not controlling this.&quot; That&#039;s why the &quot;theft&quot; propoganda has been so ineffetive. It&#039;s coming from a culture of thieves (corprations) and it goes far beyond the music industry.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ Robert #2<br />
I see control as the more motivating factor (over choice) as a primary resistance to such schemes. In a time when folks feel (with justifyable reason) that they have so little control over their own lives, I doubt seriously if control over their music collection (music is a human need after all) will be given up nilly willy. I&#8217;d love to see a figure on how many music fans stream from archive.org as opposed to how many download. (I download from it &#8211; I happen to be a big fan of live performance.) There is some security in knowing that if the rules change (and they always change)that you will still have access to music that you cherish. No matter if the IP owner decides to withdraw it. No matter how poor you might become. No matter what restrictions and punishments your government might enact. And if you have a mind to, share it with as many friends as you want to. Even after an IP owner has decided that it will no longer be available. I think one of the most powerful statements that p2p has made is this: &#8220;You&#8217;ve stolen so much conrol from my life, but you&#8217;re not controlling this.&#8221; That&#8217;s why the &#8220;theft&#8221; propoganda has been so ineffetive. It&#8217;s coming from a culture of thieves (corprations) and it goes far beyond the music industry.</p>
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		<title>By: Crosbie Fitch</title>
		<link>http://a2f2a.com/2010/01/27/the-unbundled-album/comment-page-1/#comment-1925</link>
		<dc:creator>Crosbie Fitch</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jan 2010 16:10:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://a2f2a.com/?p=1290#comment-1925</guid>
		<description>Bob, you&#039;re bumping right up against the edge of the current paradigm. If only you could punch through to the other side.

The first thing to do is to ditch the term &#039;charge&#039;. As far as recorded music goes you are no longer in a position to charge anyone anything. &#039;Charge&#039; relies on being able to sue people if they make their own copies, i.e. via copyright.

All you can do today and tomorrow is SELL. That means proposing a good bargain, an exchange of a music recording at a price that both the artist and their fans find agreeable.

So, you can sell recordings, but you can&#039;t sell copies or listens (the market for them is running on the inertia of tradition). So, you can&#039;t sell streaming services either. You can sell selection/recommendation services on top of streaming, but that&#039;s value added, you&#039;re not selling the streaming.

What people will pay for is to be provided with what they like, i.e. good recommendations, and new music from their favourite artists. A copy is worthless because a computer can make it in a millisecond for 0$. A listen is actually a burden upon the listener - it&#039;s an audition and appraisal.

So, what you&#039;re left with is introduction/selection/recommendation services (new artists) and new music (aka live and recorded performances). Once music has been paid for, that&#039;s it. Finito. No more money. It&#039;s been released, published, sold - or given away as promotion.

If you revert to the pre-copyright meaning of &#039;subscription&#039;, then your first sentence is correct. Artists must invite their fans to subscribe to a commission of their production of music recordings. Just as they invite them to purchase a ticket to a live performance.

&lt;a href=&quot;http://quidmusic.com&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;QuidMusic&lt;/a&gt; is a prototype of such a site I made a few years ago.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Bob, you&#8217;re bumping right up against the edge of the current paradigm. If only you could punch through to the other side.</p>
<p>The first thing to do is to ditch the term &#8216;charge&#8217;. As far as recorded music goes you are no longer in a position to charge anyone anything. &#8216;Charge&#8217; relies on being able to sue people if they make their own copies, i.e. via copyright.</p>
<p>All you can do today and tomorrow is SELL. That means proposing a good bargain, an exchange of a music recording at a price that both the artist and their fans find agreeable.</p>
<p>So, you can sell recordings, but you can&#8217;t sell copies or listens (the market for them is running on the inertia of tradition). So, you can&#8217;t sell streaming services either. You can sell selection/recommendation services on top of streaming, but that&#8217;s value added, you&#8217;re not selling the streaming.</p>
<p>What people will pay for is to be provided with what they like, i.e. good recommendations, and new music from their favourite artists. A copy is worthless because a computer can make it in a millisecond for 0$. A listen is actually a burden upon the listener &#8211; it&#8217;s an audition and appraisal.</p>
<p>So, what you&#8217;re left with is introduction/selection/recommendation services (new artists) and new music (aka live and recorded performances). Once music has been paid for, that&#8217;s it. Finito. No more money. It&#8217;s been released, published, sold &#8211; or given away as promotion.</p>
<p>If you revert to the pre-copyright meaning of &#8217;subscription&#8217;, then your first sentence is correct. Artists must invite their fans to subscribe to a commission of their production of music recordings. Just as they invite them to purchase a ticket to a live performance.</p>
<p><a href="http://quidmusic.com" rel="nofollow">QuidMusic</a> is a prototype of such a site I made a few years ago.</p>
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		<title>By: Robert</title>
		<link>http://a2f2a.com/2010/01/27/the-unbundled-album/comment-page-1/#comment-1924</link>
		<dc:creator>Robert</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jan 2010 15:34:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://a2f2a.com/?p=1290#comment-1924</guid>
		<description>You&#039;re holding on to the &quot;control is the only way we&#039;ll survive&quot; mentality!

Why again do people &quot;steal&quot; cable or satellite TV?  Right, because the bundles are NOT what they want!

Why again do people purchase just the tracks they want on iTunes et al?  Because the people who&#039;s spent money, you know the &lt;b&gt;source&lt;/b&gt; of the industry&#039;s revenue, should be spent on what they want, not what they are told to spend it on!

To use analogies, as some here love to do, if you walk into a grocery store in need of milk, how would you feel if instead of paying $3.49 for a 2L of skim (0%) milk, you have to pay $22.17 for a 2L of 2% milk, bananas, bread, cereal, two cans of soup, a bag of apples, two broccoli crowns, and 8 baby bok choy?

That&#039;s the problem, consumers want CHOICE and the choice should be based upon what they WANT not what those in the business of maximizing revenue want them to want.

Cable companies piss of consumers with their bundles.  Albums have been, for the last two decades or more, declining in quality (on average) where you only have 1-3 good songs and the rest is filler.

This is the reason people support iTunes.  The only thing iTunes does is give the consumer what they want, choice!

And clearly some people still want control and money over all else, even though they know that no matter what they do to control, the consumers will find a way to get &lt;i&gt; what they want&lt;/i&gt;, even if that means taking it for free.

So, you want more money? Give consumers a choice based upon what they actually want, not what you want them to want.

If no one buys your art, maybe you&#039;re not appealing to the right people and if you&#039;ve tried every demographic, then try another line of work for income, do art for yourself.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>You&#8217;re holding on to the &#8220;control is the only way we&#8217;ll survive&#8221; mentality!</p>
<p>Why again do people &#8220;steal&#8221; cable or satellite TV?  Right, because the bundles are NOT what they want!</p>
<p>Why again do people purchase just the tracks they want on iTunes et al?  Because the people who&#8217;s spent money, you know the <b>source</b> of the industry&#8217;s revenue, should be spent on what they want, not what they are told to spend it on!</p>
<p>To use analogies, as some here love to do, if you walk into a grocery store in need of milk, how would you feel if instead of paying $3.49 for a 2L of skim (0%) milk, you have to pay $22.17 for a 2L of 2% milk, bananas, bread, cereal, two cans of soup, a bag of apples, two broccoli crowns, and 8 baby bok choy?</p>
<p>That&#8217;s the problem, consumers want CHOICE and the choice should be based upon what they WANT not what those in the business of maximizing revenue want them to want.</p>
<p>Cable companies piss of consumers with their bundles.  Albums have been, for the last two decades or more, declining in quality (on average) where you only have 1-3 good songs and the rest is filler.</p>
<p>This is the reason people support iTunes.  The only thing iTunes does is give the consumer what they want, choice!</p>
<p>And clearly some people still want control and money over all else, even though they know that no matter what they do to control, the consumers will find a way to get <i> what they want</i>, even if that means taking it for free.</p>
<p>So, you want more money? Give consumers a choice based upon what they actually want, not what you want them to want.</p>
<p>If no one buys your art, maybe you&#8217;re not appealing to the right people and if you&#8217;ve tried every demographic, then try another line of work for income, do art for yourself.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Monkey D. Luffy</title>
		<link>http://a2f2a.com/2010/01/27/the-unbundled-album/comment-page-1/#comment-1921</link>
		<dc:creator>Monkey D. Luffy</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 Jan 2010 14:46:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://a2f2a.com/?p=1290#comment-1921</guid>
		<description>This is absolutely one of the WORST ideas I&#039;ve ever seen here. He wants to make music like cable!? Are you fucking kidding me!!! I understand he&#039;s speaking from an industry perspective, but seriously this is about as anti consumer as it gets. So according to Lefsez, you pay your money for the equiv of 10 songs, three are ads, three are in Spanish, one is a public service announcement and then you have three songs left you may actually want to hear. I know he and others think streaming will make piracy go away, but if anything like this ever comes to fruition piracy will become 10 times more popular than it is now. Streaming is popular on the net because people CAN cherry pick, IE HULU.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>This is absolutely one of the WORST ideas I&#8217;ve ever seen here. He wants to make music like cable!? Are you fucking kidding me!!! I understand he&#8217;s speaking from an industry perspective, but seriously this is about as anti consumer as it gets. So according to Lefsez, you pay your money for the equiv of 10 songs, three are ads, three are in Spanish, one is a public service announcement and then you have three songs left you may actually want to hear. I know he and others think streaming will make piracy go away, but if anything like this ever comes to fruition piracy will become 10 times more popular than it is now. Streaming is popular on the net because people CAN cherry pick, IE HULU.</p>
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